Caliber of choice

[CAL]

I'm curious what the opinions are about the best caliber for LE purposes. I think my preference at this point is the .45 ACP - I prefer the larger round over the velocity of the .40. I also don't care for the additional recoil that the .40 presents.

[Trip_Wire]

I prefer .45 caliber; however, since I have a .40 Cal Glock Model 27 I carry and use it because it is more concealable then all the pistols in .45 that I have.

[CAL]

I prefer .45 caliber; however, since I have a .40 Cal Glock Model 27 I carry and use it because it is more concealable then all the pistols in .45 that I have.
I do wish Glock would come out with a compact .45

[Broke Hoss]

I carried 10mm for years. I've since gone with .357 sig. I like the penetration offered by both. Ain't nothing wrong with ya'll's 45's either (I got 1 of them too). Course I still got my old mdl 66 that I started with.

[CAL]

I carried 10mm for years. I've since gone with .357 sig. I like the penetration offered by both. Ain't nothing wrong with ya'll's 45's either (I got 1 of them too). Course I still got my old mdl 66 that I started with.
How was the 10mm to carry around size wise? Not too big and heavy I guess?

[Broke Hoss]

How was the 10mm to carry around size wise? Not too big and heavy I guess?
Actually that's why I moved away from it. I was carrying the S&W mdl 1086, the 1st auto we were authorized. Great gun, it literally went bang everytime I asked it to for the many years I carried it. It even fed a couple of fired cases from the mag when we tried to induce a FTF during class!

But it is a big chunk of stainless steel. But I'm a fairly big guy, 6'6"/235. My fully loaded Glock with light weighs less than the empty S&W. Going to he Glock increased my ammo capicity (28-vs-46).

I really liked the 10mm rnd, reminded me of the old 41 Mag. I could shoot the gun accurately & was very satisfied with performance. Only reason I didn't go with a Glock 10mm is I kept my old S&W & I don't see much sence in having 2 guns of the same caliber.

What precipitated the change was the weight. I suffered a back injury & needed to lighten the load on my back/hips. Went to nylon gear as well & can really tell the difference.

[Feet]

I carry .45 myself but I have carried 9mm and .40 on duty. Some agencies are using the .357 Sig which I hear is a damn good round. It is supposed to get good vehicle penetration and it comes in the major polymer platforms.

If I had to buy my own ammo for everything I might just stick with .40 but my dept pays for all my ammo so I love my .45.

I have a few .40 guns and I am thinking about getting a .357 Sig barrel for my G22 for fun.

The 10mm is a very good cartridge but not for pistol rookies as it needs a good solid platform and is sometimes large due to cartridge length. It is the ballistic equivalent to the .41 Magnum. It had its 15 minutes of fame when the FBI temporarily adopted it in response to the Miami shootout. It also saw some screen time with Don Johnson in the Bren Ten semi-auto in the old Miami Vice series. I hear the Glock models are doing well with it.

http://www.renar.gov.ar/cursos/novearmas/modelos/archivos/06-2002/img/bren_ten4in.jpg

[Broke Hoss]

Some agencies are using the .357 Sig which I hear is a damn good round. It is supposed to get good vehicle penetration and it comes in the major polymer platforms.

This & some terminal ballistic studies I looked at; along with talking to my favorite firearms examiner & M.E..

It had its 15 minutes of fame when the FBI temporarily adopted it in response to the Miami shootout.
And this is how the 10mm came to us. It was fun to reload for. Never fired at work other than qualification, but I did take a nice 225 lbs hog with 1 shot with it.

FEET; give the 357 Sig a try. Ammo's a little expensive & it's a butt to reload because of the bottleneck. But I shot it & 40 S&W side by side; I couldn't tell that much difference in recoil (others can). 357 did have a little more concussion. You can literaly see the steel plates get thrown down faster with the 357.

[FerretLE426]

We were the first State to adopt the .357 Sig. It is a solid round and I like it. We have found that females and small handed folks have issue with the cartridge. I have a small hand and I have no problems with the round. :dunno:
I will tell you that the .357 Sig screams like a Banshee and it will travel for miles approximately 1.5 inches off the concrete. My buddy was shot by a rookie in the foot. The round did exactly that skipped once and flew straight as an arrow ...that is until Bruce's boot got in the way.
Anyway I like the .357 Sig but I carry .40 S&W because of the aforementioned problems. I had to go with what would be the best for my department as a whole. :dunno:

[cherokeegunsmith]

Parole Officers in Texas do NOT have to carry firearms, it's optional and a matter of personal choice on the officer's part. Our office is authorized 2 Supervisors and 17 Officers. We are short 1 Officer. Of those 18 personnel on duty, 12 are authorized to be armed. (I can't say with absolute certainty, but on a percentage basis we are probably the most armed Parole Office in the State of Texas). Of the 12 armed Officers, the caliber prefernce is : .40= 3, 9mm=7, .45=2. Myself and my younger brother (1 of the supervisors) are in the .45 camp. This may have something to do with our both being ex-Army, and using the M1911 in our Army days.

[Feet]

Parole Officers in Texas do NOT have to carry firearms, it's optional and a matter of personal choice on the officer's part. Our office is authorized 2 Supervisors and 17 Officers. We are short 1 Officer. Of those 18 personnel on duty, 12 are authorized to be armed. (I can't say with absolute certainty, but on a percentage basis we are probably the most armed Parole Office in the State of Texas). Of the 12 armed Officers, the caliber prefernce is : .40= 3, 9mm=7, .45=2. Myself and my younger brother (1 of the supervisors) are in the .45 camp. This may have something to do with our both being ex-Army, and using the M1911 in our Army days.
Hells yeah.

I am thinkin about getting a .357 Sig barrel for my G22 and buying a few boxes for it.

[cherokeegunsmith]

I have a conversion barrel in .357SIG for my Glock 22, fortunately I bought a case of practice ammo back before the "ammo crisis" and still have most of it. The price of even practice ammo for .357SIG is OBSCENE! Just another reason to stick with old slab-sides (ie M1911) in .45.

[Sesarge]

This is my first post here. I'm a 27 year cop and I've spent a lot of time shooting, reloading and hunting. I've followed the terminal ballistics arguments presented since the early seventies. I've reloaded for all of the conventional pistol cartridges except .357 (the bottleneck case and higher pressures are a pain for reloading). I've hunted with handguns including .454 Casull and .500 Linebaugh.
To my way of thinking, there's not a nickel's worth of difference in most of the common police pistol rounds, with one exception. They're all pretty much marginal when it comes to stopping a motivated, individual who may be feeling little pain. (Who's our customer base when it comes to shootings?) Don't believe for a minute the lore of the .45. Bullet placement is paramount with a pistol.
The one cartridge that I do have a higher regard for is the .357 Sig. It's difference is tied to it's kinetic energy. When Sig introduced the round, it's goal was to duplicate the ballistics of the most effective defensive pistol round of the time, the 125g .357 magnum. They succeeded admirably, and the 125g bullet of the Sig leaves a service length barrel at around 1450fps. This is far more likely to produce hydrostatic shock than the 230g .45 or the 165g .40 or 147g 9mm that most Departments seem to favor. My Department doesn't allow the .357 Sig. If it did, I'd have a Glock full of em.

Fred

[CAL]

I will be purchasing a weapon for duty use in the near future. I'm currently debating whether to purchase a weapon chambered in .45 or .357 SIG. I am very familiar with the .45 but I have been reading some good things about the .357 SIG. I already own a couple .45s but don't have anything in .357 SIG.

[Feet]

If you buy your own ammo, go 9mm.
If you get ammo for free, .45 or .357 Sig are good people stopper.

[CAL]

If you buy your own ammo, go 9mm.
If you get ammo for free, .45 or .357 Sig are good people stopper.
9mm? Why (besides the lesser cost)? I'm not sure I'd be comfortable with the 9mm cartridge for duty use.

[DD78]

If you're debating .357 Sig or .45, I'd choose the .357.

Better penetration through obstructions like cars.

[DD78]

This is my first post here. I'm a 27 year cop and I've spent a lot of time shooting, reloading and hunting. I've followed the terminal ballistics arguments presented since the early seventies. I've reloaded for all of the conventional pistol cartridges except .357 (the bottleneck case and higher pressures are a pain for reloading). I've hunted with handguns including .454 Casull and .500 Linebaugh.
To my way of thinking, there's not a nickel's worth of difference in most of the common police pistol rounds, with one exception. They're all pretty much marginal when it comes to stopping a motivated, individual who may be feeling little pain. (Who's our customer base when it comes to shootings?) Don't believe for a minute the lore of the .45. Bullet placement is paramount with a pistol.
The one cartridge that I do have a higher regard for is the .357 Sig. It's difference is tied to it's kinetic energy. When Sig introduced the round, it's goal was to duplicate the ballistics of the most effective defensive pistol round of the time, the 125g .357 magnum. They succeeded admirably, and the 125g bullet of the Sig leaves a service length barrel at around 1450fps. This is far more likely to produce hydrostatic shock than the 230g .45 or the 165g .40 or 147g 9mm that most Departments seem to favor. My Department doesn't allow the .357 Sig. If it did, I'd have a Glock full of em.

Fred

Your input is appreciated. Could you shoot on over to the introduction forums and post an intro thread for us? (pun intended)

Thanks.

[Feet]

9mm? Why (besides the lesser cost)? I'm not sure I'd be comfortable with the 9mm cartridge for duty use.

I hate to bash the 9 mike mike but when I started to carry my G17 on duty, I started to have dreams of my gun not stopping suspects. I went up to .40, then .45. The dreams stopped.
Now it might just be some psychosis in me but I prefer something other than 9mm.:freak:

[CAL]

I hate to bash the 9 mike mike but when I started to carry my G17 on duty, I started to have dreams of my gun not stopping suspects. I went up to .40, then .45. The dreams stopped.
Now it might just be some psychosis in me but I prefer something other than 9mm.:freak:
Hey goofball, you're the one that suggested the 9mm up above.:loser:

[Feet]

Hey goofball, you're the one that suggested the 9mm up above.:loser:

Right but you are a rookie, and you are not a freak like me. The 9 did everything I wanted it to but I am super paranoid. I carry 2 guns on me and 2 in the car for a reason, because I like to WIN.:popcorn:

[Maverick1701]

.45 acp ftw

[Willard]

Since this got resurrected......I guess I am the lone vote for 9mm. On-duty I carry a 40-Dept choice. If we carried what we wanted, I would carry a 45 or a 9. Probably the Glock 17 though. I am a big fan of shot placement and (IMO) the 9 can do the job.

[Chapman38]

Not a policeman but if I had to choose I would choose the Springfield XD .40m for stopping power and capacity. (16+1)

[Feet]

IIRC my esteemed collegue Senor Cal now uses .45.

[CAL]

IIRC my esteemed collegue Senor Cal now uses .45.

Correctomundo brother Feet.

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[DD78]

IIRC my esteemed collegue Senor Cal now uses .45.


And he's still a rookie. :nono:

[Swat791]

Willard, I voted for the 9mm as well.

I prefer less recoil and faster target acquisition that a 9mm handgun gives and with a well placed 147 gr bullet it will do what it was intended. Stop the threat.

IMO, cops put to much faith in a caliber vs. shot placement. I hate to be the one that says it but 45s don't stop people in their tracks and "knock them down".
I have to say that proper shot placement will stop someone!

As far as penetration, I've always felt the the 9mm can penetrate just as well as the .45 and the .40 cal.

I saw a video and the scenario was shooting through object in a house at a bad guy. A 4' wide bookcase w/ 5-6 different thickness books was the shoot through medium.
The .45 went through the end of the bookshelf (3/4" laminated MDF) and into the 2bd book, the .40 went through the end of the bookshelf and into the 4th book and the 9mm went through the bookshelf, all the books and into and bulged the laminate on the opposite end of the bookshelf.
The observation was the 9mm out penetrated the 40 cal and .45.

The .357 Sig was not part of the test but the "hyper-velocity" that the .357 Sig offers would of out penetrated all calibers. That is one thing about the 125 gr. bullet in a .357 Sig that is likable, a relativity small bullet traveling at a very high velocity that translates to hydro-shock and severe tissue displacement!

We all have to have faith in what we carry and whatever we carry we have to believe it is going to do the job we want it to. Just as important we all need to get trigger time in and learn how to shoot. We need not just shoot at a stationary target, but shoot at moving targets, shoot on the run, use cover and concealment, hostage (moving) targets, etc.
There is no reason "regular patrol" officers should not be able to shoot as good as or better than tactical officer!

[Willard]

Yep...what he said

[Jeffy]

I carry a 40 but have carried 357 sig when I worked just the interstate. The preferance has more to do with where and what you work, I believe.

Sight alignment and trigger control and just keep pressing the trigger until you get desired results.

[CAL]

I carry a 40 but have carried 357 sig when I worked just the interstate. The preferance has more to do with where and what you work, I believe.

Sight alignment and trigger control and just keep pressing the trigger until you get desired results.

How would you compare the two?

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[Jeffy]

I have seen people, and cars shot with both and shot placement is where it's at. The 357 sig was a bit "snappy" to shoot but if you train with it you can shoot it. I find I'm a bit more opinionated about the ammo that I run versus the caliber.

Good positive expansion bullets that hold mass and dont come apart. I have seen alot better results ammo that doesnt lose a jacket or come apart going thru flesh, autoglass, heavy clothing, and car bodies.

As far as wound trauma, the 357 was hard to beat with good bullets. But a handgun is what I use to fight my way back to my unit to get a long gun.